A few years ago, a “hip-hop church” began to work in Ukraine. It was founded by a group of rappers and breakdancers from Zaporozhye, who communicated with young people at concerts and sang songs about how God changes lives. One of the ideologists of the community was Sasha Chef, leader of the Gospel People team and author lines "Jesus is my president".
The group had its own hit. Released in 2011, the acutely social video for the song “Protest” was not very popular at first, and then it was re-uploaded to an unofficial YouTube channel, where it acquired the clickbait title “Clip Banned by All Channels” and, as a result, 11 million views. Fantastic figures for those times.
Now Chef lives in Kyiv - and continues to move gospel to the masses. This is the name of the team he founded, whose concert here in 2018 was attended by 600 spectators. We wanted to learn more about the phenomenon of gospel rap and talked to Alexander about how people start to repent at his concerts, what Pharaoh song he likes the most and why Kanye West's music is the handwriting of the devil.
When they told me that there is a hip-hop church in Ukraine, I immediately imagined a monastery where b-boys live and read prayers to the beat. It's probably different.
It's not a place, but a series of events. We spent them on Saturdays at the Wake Up dance center in Zaporozhye. Five years ago, when we launched, there was a dance boom in the city, and places for jams are few. That's why they came to battle us. We talked with the youth and also prayed for the city. This is a platform where it is easier to get to know each other, the Bible and faith.
Depending on the season, the format of the hip-hop church changed. In the summer, we went out to the square, with speakers and a DJ, and held a street ministry. We had an agreement with the mayor's office. It looked something like on Khreshchatyk, where the b-boys near the “poppy” are jamming on cardboard. Plus, we talked about what God (the speaker asked to capitalize any mention of God in his remarks - approx. The Flow) did for our lives. If you walk up to a guy or a girl and say, "Come to church!", it won't work. The guys watched our performances and saw that the young people were talented and beautiful, without smoking and beer, but with conversations about values.
- Did you gather a lot of people?
At first, the hands went down. Despite the fact that there were 15 people in our team, three or five new guys came to our evenings. Then it like a snowball gained momentum. Up to 60 people in the ballroom, up to 200 - in street performances.
- Rap and church started at the same time for you?
- Music - before. From 15 years old. We had a big party: MS T, Keks, Carats, Artik, Paravoz. We hung out, danced, bombed. When they began to read rap, they divided into groups. I was a member of the Power Block team.
At the age of 17, when I became a believer and came to church, there was already a group there. They read, prepared a couple of songs for Easter and Christmas. I'm used to the fact that you always have to be in music. I realized that through it you can influence the youth. There are quite a few bands in the States that work this way. Now we are the pioneers of a new genre in Russian rap. We call it gospel rap.
- Come to church at 17. How is it?
3 years before that, my mother came to the church and was transformed. She sold cigarettes and alcohol in the market. There was no father, it was necessary to support me and my younger sister. She cursed harshly - the market is the same - and after coming to church she immediately stopped. I realized that it works and began to listen more carefully when she touched on this topic, otherwise it was embarrassing to talk about God with friends in childhood. I remember that once I fell ill, I had a fever. Mom came to me at night, put her hand on me and began to pray. By the next morning, I had fully recovered. Little by little, I started to have faith. I began to repent, because from the age of 15, the boys and I dived into nightclubs, parties.
I remember that on the day I decided to come to church, there was a struggle going on inside me. For half a day I am sure that I am going, and for half a day I wave it off: “What kind of church, what are you talking about! All kents will be banned.” In the end, I went, but my one friend called everyone and said: “Chef went to church. We must rescue him from the sect.” In our church, in order to turn to God and repent, we had to go to the stage and pray with the pastor. Estimate: I go out and see that all the Kents have gathered in the hall. It would seem 17 years old, but even then I realized that I was making a vital choice. I got over the fear of what my friends would think of me. About 10 years later, this Kent, who called everyone together, asked me for a Bible himself. He had life crises.
- Having moved to Kyiv, did you try to start a hip-hop church here?
- Not yet. Kyiv is different. What works in Zaporozhye does not work here. The mentality of young people is different. Here we started the project “Gospel to the masses” with the song of the same name. At the stage of preparing the video, I met people who helped organize a concert at the Bingo club (a hall with a capacity of 2 thousand people, where rock concerts are regularly held, as well as performances by Face, Pharaoh, Thomas Mraz- approx. The Flow). We do a concert - and 600 people come. It was a shock for us.
- This is not a ticket concert?
To get on it, it was necessary to come for an invitation. We wrote on social networks where you can get them. They wrote to me from the nearest cities: “40 tickets have come out, we will arrive by bus.”
- Did the union church bring people?
- No, no, just young people who wanted to get in. The clip played such a role.
- If these are just young people who do not spend time in one team, then how could they organize themselves in a bus tour for 40 people?
- They could be in some church, I don't know. They write to us that they want to come. We are just glad.
- Projects Gospel People and "Gospel to the masses" sound like you're well aware of what's going on in the genre. Is it difficult for you to listen to the new rap?
- It's like football. You want to learn sports techniques - and it doesn't matter who the teacher is. You adopt a technique, not a philosophy of life. Therefore, we draw inspiration from real life examples and the Bible, and we notice the musical and technical basis from our artists.
In the States, artists are divided into two types. For some, God is part of the repertoire. Just one of the topics, in addition to virgins and smoking. And there are those for whom faith is a way of life. And if you are an opinion leader, if you are being watched more closely, you should stumble - and it will be inflated to the whole world. There may be intentional set-ups. I heard about a preacher who always went into his hotel room second. Someone was walking in front of him, because paparazzi and a couple of naked girls could be waiting in the room for a photo. When you are influential and declare something, they want to discredit you. It was the same with Christ.
- So, about Kanye. The man calls himself “Yeezus” and releases the song “I Am God”. How do you like that?
This is the handwriting of the devil. The devil in heaven was the most important in music and praise. The Old Testament writes that he wanted to become God and thought: “I will make the same throne next to me so that they worship me.” For this, God cast him out. Kanye West's actions are the character of the devil. All who once thought: "I am great" have fallen.
- Three favorite Kendrick Lamar songs?
- “Humble”, “DNA”, “Element”. I like it in this style.
- I'm surprised that you name the most trap, simple things of his.
- But I don't know what these songs are about (laughs). Didn't get into it. I do not know English.
- There is not a word about the bad in Gospel People rap. About what you see when you go out into the street. It's weird to pretend it doesn't exist.
“Now we are at a turning point. Discussing how to expand our audience. We're somewhere radical gospel. It is understandable to church people, but it is necessary that everyone.
- Yes, and not church - quite. You seem to exist in a parallel reality.
- Each artist creates his own. Take the Yanix album. His parallel reality- these are girls, grandmas, chains and brand tags.
About seven years ago there was a stage when 70% of our songs were social. At the same time, we released the video “Protest”. Then we went back to gospel.
- Don't you think that "Protest" is a retelling of a news release?
Well no. We list what does not suit us, and at the end we read: “There is a flame in our hearts. We do not wait for changes, we make them ourselves.” The song “Protest” has a backstory: there is a youth organization “Hand of Support” in Zaporozhye. With her in the areas we did concert programs social character. On the day when we performed in the most unfavorable area of Pavlo-Kichkas, the police did not receive a single drive of drunken, beaten or robbed people. They say it's the first time in years.
In another district, Osipenkovsky, we held a concert in the yard with large playground, they put the stage and sound. Directly opposite the house where there was an alcohol point. Everyone knew - both the police and the alcoholics - that they made burnt vodka and sold it. We came there, read songs, and the leader of the youth organization, a believer, began to say directly into the microphone that the owner of this business would have a curse, because people die and burn because of him. And then he prayed, saying, “Lord, let this point be closed.” The owner of the store immediately flew in with a scandal: “Why are you praying for such a bad thing?” As a result, this point closed after two weeks. We saw that if you are not silent, but you speak, there is always feedback. After these actions, we wrote a “Protest”, but first we got the job done.
- In this song you protest against gay culture. Why?
- It's a bad culture. The culture of extinction. God originally planned man and woman so that they could continue. Gay culture under itself has the foundation of the fact that gays take into families children who are not born to them. And these children, too, can grow up with a disturbed psyche and have unhealthy relationships.
You don't have statistics to support this.
Disagree. If, for example, a child, a guy, lived in a family where the father did not respect the mother and drank, then there is a high probability that he will do the same. Because when you grow up, you absorb everything like a sponge. And when children grow up in such families, they absorb the fact that such relationships are the norm.
- These are completely different things.
- And you - for?
- I am for a person to be happy - no matter with a man or a woman.
- Well, if you show me happy gays...
- Yesterday I walked around Kiev. I saw two completely happy dudes walking arm in arm.
- It is now! Everyone has their moment. But years will pass 10… I heard that gay men have at least 40 partners in their lives. This is statistics. When we held protest actions, the leader of the youth organization monitored it all. And gay people are depressed. Such relationships affect the psyche. Scientists prove that this is a disease.
- Gays are not God's children?
- God loves all people, but God hates sin, and homosexuality is a sin. In the Old Testament, people were stoned for such a sin. In the New Testament it is written like this: people who knew God, but did not give him glory as God, He gave to a perverted mind. So women began to lust after women, and men began to lust after men.
There is a theme that gays come to church, and after a while they stop being gay. But this happens very rarely.
- On your Facebook I saw a quote from Matthew about why you can’t judge others. Why are you judging?
If we're talking about people, that's one thing, but if we're talking about culture as propaganda... Well, here's a gay parade. After all, they are made in honor of victory. In sports, for example. What did the gays win that they want to parade? It's propaganda, after all. There is a gay manifesto on the Internet and it is very aggressive. Someone will say: "People love each other - so be it." I personally don't care. Well, you want each other, smack at home. But under the laws that they want to put forward now, ordinary families are being infringed more, because so many privileges are given to protect gays that you are simply afraid to breathe in their direction.
I remember that during the period of Decl's popularity, he was asked on the air why he was such an opponent of the LGBT theme. And he answered sooooo correctly: “Well, just think about it. This is shit!” Well, handsome, he took the truth and slashed it. Well, what is love?
- Did the clip "Protest" become your main hit?
One guy, with whom we later talked, posted a video on his channel and called it “Clip banned by all channels”. For some reason, the clip began to gain millions of views. For the first year - about a million, and then - a million a month. Dropped 11 million.
This is 2011. YouTube has never been so popular. Nobody thought about monetization. Neither Potap nor Irina Bilyk could boast of such numbers. Then the video was banned. I guess it happened because we gave it to the ELLO video channel. Now I'm thinking why. They did it and it's fine.
- What will you do if you hear that your daughter's Face is playing in the headphones?
- (laughs for a long time) I will smile and offer to throw this rubbish away. Believers do not aim to categorically prohibit. Jesus didn't do that. Jesus talked, he asked leading questions: “Why do you like it? What do you get from it?”. If my daughter picks up a knife, I don't yell at her to throw it away or she'll cut herself. I teach her how to cut bread.
She usually dances with me to the songs of the Time and Glass group. This is her top. She likes everything so modern and youthful. We are now visiting my wife's parents, and dad loves to play old music, something about slow about love. Daughter and says to him: "Grandfather, well, your music is hilarious." That is, for her it is no longer music. My goal is not to prohibit, but to explain why it is bad and give the person a choice.
- Do you draw conclusions about a generation by watching what kind of music is popular?
- Music is the mirror of a generation. It's trendy because people communicate like that. Now in music it is allowed to use obscenities and candid shots. If earlier it was at least somehow censored, now you can sing about a burger.
I once watched the program “Let them talk” with Malakhov, where the teenage rock group Klimbatika participated. All their clips are covered in blood. The producer of the Gaza Strip was present on the air, and he invited everyone to see how the members of this team ended up: someone got drunk, someone died, someone got hooked on drugs. After all, initially everything is innocent and hilarious, but after that there will definitely be fruits, because we sow it. We do not yet know what will grow out of the new generation. To some extent, I'm even afraid. In terms of future personnel for work, in terms of future families, fathers, mothers. I think it will be tough. I believe in the best.
If now we, the generation with a post-Soviet upbringing, see the statistics, according to which every third family is incomplete, where the mother herself raises the children, then what's next? So now I want to write songs about family values. Like Basta's track “Papa What's Up”. This is a company! It is clear how he loves his daughters. He understands this buzz when they are waiting for you. This needs to be instilled. But songs and news about good things are sold poorly. Perhaps the clip “Protest” went to the masses, because the description “Clip banned by all channels” played.
- Found a recording of the Gospel People anniversary concert on YouTube. There is a phrase in the signature: “That evening 55 people accepted Jesus Christ, having prayed the prayer of repentance.”
- In the middle of the concert, I went out and delivered a five-minute speech about the fact that God has a life, a great future and destiny for everyone. And he invited those who want to get to know God and live with him further to come up to the stage. 55 people came out. There was a man who took them to the hall, presented them with New Testaments and CDs. He did the counting.
Can gospel rap be politically oppositional?
We have song "No War", it can be attributed to this genre. There are two neutral verses. That the war is coming and it sucks for everyone. And our friend has a desk there that his brother went to his brother. We understand our point of view at that time. We were convinced that Russia had attacked Ukraine. This was not given directly, we used the types of Cain and Abel. Now we understand that both are good! But then they spoke as they saw. Many wrote that we are wrong, that Russia is not in the Donbass. This is our view. Rap was political in the beginning, take the same Public Enemy. These topics have always come up. Eminem seemed to be saying, “If I have something to say, I will. If not, I won't say anything." We were then burned alive. It was impossible to be silent.
- Tell me this thing: is Darwin a fool?
Why?
- Because of the theory of the origin of man.
- That's the theory. He had the right to be wrong. So you can ask about Adam and Eve, are they fools that they messed up our whole life? We would be living just fine now. One preacher said that if he met Adam in heaven, he would definitely hit him.
The Ukrainian edition karabas.live talked to Lyon, who is in full swing working on his new album and prophesies that soon hip-hop will shoot in Ukraine. We have traditionally prepared a cut of the most interesting moments.
About the Ukrainian audience
To wide audience picked up the material, it should be presented to her in an accessible way. Today, the Ukrainian listener has this perception: if a rapper is from Russia, then this is some big figure like Basta or Scryptonite, and if rap is from Ukraine, then this is something in the spirit of TNMK or Tartak. This perception has settled in the minds, and we need to work with it, change it. At the same time, the Russian rap industry is largely Ukrainians. Both at the level of songwriting and production.
About hip-hop
Most of the world has already figured out what hip-hop is all about. There is no artificiality, fakeness in it. The pop industry, before the rise of hip-hop, created hits through big money and connections. But over time, she came to the conclusion that even if you are, relatively speaking, Katy Perry, it’s still better for you to go to the guys who rap and mix. Make a cocktail of hit with badass.
About HitWonder,Lyon label
We are building a label not in the usual sense of the word, but as a company that will be a friend of the artist. I dealt with big labels - "Monolith", CD Land, "Nikitin" - and I know what the performers lack in working with them. Therefore, when talking with an artist, I do not sit in front of him, but next to him. This is important point in the ideology of HitWonder.
About songwriting
As a songwriter, I collaborate with our pop artists. And they sometimes receive an order to make a hip-hop track. But they are still acting autonomously, they want to do everything themselves. It will pass. You can’t suddenly read a rap, as if you changed your shoes into new shoes. Therefore, I do not agree to make such material even for large fees. This is a substitution of concepts.
Recall that recently Lyon released, recorded with singer Sonya. The song will be included in the rapper's album Ornament.
The headliner of which will be Decl. We decided to remember how hip-hop was born in Ukraine and asked those who saw how it all began.
Oleg "Fagot" Mikhailyuta, musician, vocalist of the TNMK group. In the 90s, he led the RAP-clip program on UT-2 and organized the festival of hip-hop culture In Da House in Kharkov
Bassoon
In the 90s, the party looked motley. Few people understood what hip-hop was, the establishment treated it as a very short-lived phenomenon, and typical representatives of residential areas were drawn to something new and honest.
Hip-hopers wore tracksuits, wide leg pants, caps, all clothes - a couple of sizes too big.
The most eccentric people put chains around their necks - ordinary iron chains, and if they managed to break off the Mercedes badge somewhere, then they immediately hung it on them
In general, as they could, they parodied movies from video salons. Recently, I even found a T-shirt and superstars in the rubble at home, which I bought back in 1996 and in which I hosted the “RAP clip” program.
My favorite band at the time was Das EFX. It seemed to me that these guys were the embodiment of a complete rejection of showbiz: they played a primitive and hard Mouzon, were dressed in black, cursed through the word, spat at the camera and were the complete opposite of the shiny tight pants and painted shooters of the then rock idols.
The most vivid memory is how in 1994 we managed to structure the hip-hop movement in Ukraine through the RAP-clip TV program and create the festival of hip-hop culture In Da House, around which everyone who breathed hip-hop united.
It was the first and only hip-hop festival in the post-Soviet area at that time. Groups from all over Ukraine came to In Da House in Kharkiv
We listened to the material and gave the stage to the best. And then they told everyone about it in the “RAP-clip” - the air on UT-2 allowed us to go into a large number of houses. In 1995, even Mikhey premiered at our festival the then unrecorded “Bitch-Love” - a solo with double bass.
If we talk about the modern hip-hop get-together, then everything is cyclical and repeats itself on a new round and a bit in new form. But the essence, as in that joke about swans, remains the same: “Dad, where are these swans flying?” - "To the fuck, son, everything in this world flies to the fuck."
Mikhail Dikun, formerly DJ Misha Mechanik, was the organizer of hip-hop and R&B parties, a resident of R`n`B Cafe, Forsage, etc. clubs.
Mikhail Dikun
In the Kiev hip-hop get-together of the 90s, there was everything: both “stray” who poured in for the season, and those who could be met for years in clubs, on open airs, on the district and on basketball courts. Everyone was interested in everything, collected information bit by bit, got out of nowhere rap albums and rewrote them.
Everyone dressed terribly then - mostly in second-hand clothes. But still, they tried to have at least some attribute of hip-hop culture brought from the States, or at least fan-made merchandise: a Public Enemy T-shirt, a House of Pain pendant, or a Cypress Hill baseball cap. Then, of course, baggy jeans of modern tailoring were difficult to grab, but quite real, and therefore in Kyiv everyone looked more or less worthy.
There was no difference between rappers, breakers, DJs, graphite artists and others - everyone was doing everything at the same time.
No one focused on one thing, which caused the quality to suffer: they danced badly, they didn’t read very well, bombing graffiti was also unimportant
Well, there was no Internet to see how it should be.
There were almost no tattoos: the masters then were the same as rappers - clumsy, and filled with strange blue spots. Yes, and wearing a tattoo was not in trend - you were immediately identified as a seated or VDE player. But on the other hand, they wore earrings, and even grandmothers were no longer afraid of piercings in their ears.
Everyone was more or less equal and familiar with each other. The beauty of those years was that, having seen some attribute of hip-hop on a stranger, you could easily approach him, chat and not run into a disapproving look. Everyone was friendly and made contact.
It's nice to remember any concert in the club, on the Maidan (at that time the Adidas StreetChallenge was held annually), even against the background of constant student lack of money, and then I had a scholarship of 9 UAH.
Now everything is different, there is a lot of information, and I even miss the times when I had to wait for the weekend to go to Petrovka for the long-awaited collection on cassette
Today, everything is fine with music and access to it - you can take a phone with your entire home music library and not carry ten cassettes and replaceable batteries in your backpack. The player does not jam the film and the headphones are of excellent quality. You can write any track in any program and it won't be too expensive.
It's a great time to stand out and create your product, but for some reason, few people use it. Everyone is used to copying the successful, and this is the problem: when everything becomes in abundance, the brain stops thinking.
Evgeny Kibets, concert director of SENTRUM, in the late 90s - a member of the Natural Born group
Evgeny Kibets
In the late 90s - early 2000s, the Ukrainian hip-hop community was on the rise. There were many good artists, although only a few have survived to this day. But the most important thing was the audience.
Kyiv club "Ultra" united all fans and performers. Hundreds of people gathered there every Saturday. And it doesn’t matter who spoke – the main thing was the atmosphere: at that time there were no social networks and people communicated live.
The most vivid memory is going on stage in front of the packed capital clubs “Ultra” or “Zhaba”. Although I can not say that something is missing. It was a period that I really liked, but remained in the past.
Unfortunately, the hip-hop party is no more. There are few performers. Many bands have ceased to exist in these 20 years, and new ones appear rarely and either become a production project or perform in clubs for 20-40 people.
The very concept of a “hip-hop party” disappeared - just as what united it disappeared: “Ultra”, “X3M” magazine, Hip-Hop Shop #1 clothing store
Andrey Chudlya, DJ Andrew, a member of TNMK, one of the first in Ukraine to start making video sets, a master of scratching and playing on vinyl
Andrey Chudlya
In the 90s, hip-hop culture was in the underground, and its representatives were clearly different from ordinary youth. The majority attributed us to informals, and an ordinary walk on the Maidan could end in a brawl. So it was also extreme.
In addition to the legendary 2Pac, Onyx, Notorius Big, Cypres Hill, which everyone listened to, there was a wave of Ukrainian hip-hop, and groups such as Killed by Rap, Schnel Sprechen, Tree of Life, TNMK were very popular. In general, Kharkiv was the leader in rap, therefore the above-mentioned characters were the idols of the party. The group "Green Chestnuts" was popular in the Kiev party.
I loved the hip-hop parties and hangouts back then. When you get there, you find yourself in a completely different, unreal atmosphere.
Some things - like finding a flyer to a party (because it's cheaper to get in) or having a drink in front of a club (because the club is expensive) - is now generally difficult to understand
The modern crowd is moving towards concerts. Well, the youth at these parties are more solvent. You can now buy almost any clothes, and therefore appearance became more civilized, there are practically no freak characters.
Sergey Lion Demyanko, CEO of the HitWonder label, rap artist and sound producer. He was recognized as the best rap artist of the year at the Showtime HipHop / Rnb Awards 2008, with the support of MTV Ukraine
Sergei Lion Demianko
Since I was born and raised in Kharkiv, I watched the party from the inside: it’s not for nothing that Kharkov bears the title of Rapa City – the capital of hip-hop in our country. Kharkiv had its own fashion for hip-hop - a sports gopnik. The cool ones wore Nikes, and the coolest ones wore Jordans
They tried to be like their overseas idols: Onyx, Cypress Hill, Wu-Tang, 2Pac. It was difficult to get some original clothes, so those who managed to bring something from abroad (conditional Fubu or Karl Kani) were kings.
And the main source of hip-hop clothes was second-hand, and most of them dressed just ridiculous.
My favorite bands then were TNMK and VUZV. I remember their cassettes very well. At that time there was no product at this level. There were also well-known “Killed by rap” and “Fog”. I still remember well the In Da House festival with TNMK headliners.
It seems to me that today there is not enough originality and a shortage of the genre.
Now there is too much information flow, and then one album was released, and everyone listened to it for five years
In the US, hip-hop has officially become the number one music. It went through many stages of development, mixing styles and offshoots. I think it will definitely develop in our country. Ukraine is rich in talents, and hip-hop is no exception.
Soon a simple guy from the people will come who will sweep everyone away with his rap. I believe in it.
Illustrations: Olga Liskevich